Mirrorless crop that has sunk into the abyss

The days of this writing are raging mirrorless fever, but many mirrorless cameras and even entire systems simply did not live up to this time, and some survive their last days.

Mirrorless mirrors quickly appear and quickly die

Mirrorless mirrors quickly appear and quickly die

Here we will talk about mirrorless crop, i.e. About mirrorless cameras with a sensor, less than 36 * 24 mm.

Nikon 1 system (Kf = 2.7x)

The classic representative of the deceased species. The system was announced 21 September 2011 yearslast camera was announced April 2 2015 years. The system, in fact, lived only 4 years. Now the system is not developing and is considered dead.

The system created as many as four lines of cameras, some of which underwent as many as five iterations:

  1. J: Nikon 1 J1, Nikon 1 J2, Nikon 1 J3, Nikon 1 J4, Nikon 1 J5
  2. S: Nikon 1 S1Nikon 1 S2
  3. V: Nikon 1 V1, Nikon 1 V2, Nikon 1 V3
  4. AW: Nikon 1AW1

And not the smallest optics park:

  1. Nikon 10 / 2.8
  2. Nikon AW 10 / 2.8
  3. Nikon 18.5 / 1.8
  4. Nikon 32 / 1.2
  5. Nikon 6.7-13 / 3.5-5.6
  6. Nikon 10-30 / 3.5-5.6
  7. Nikon 10-30 / 3.5-5.6 PD-ZOOM
  8. Nikon 10-100 / 4-5.6
  9. Nikon 10-100 / 4.5-5.6 PD-ZOOM
  10. Nikon 11-27.5 / 3.5-5.6
  11. Nikon AW 11-27.5 / 3.5-5.6
  12. Nikon 30-110 / 3.8-5.6
  13. Nikon 70-300 / 4.5-5.6
  14. FT1 adapter for some Nikon AF-S lenses

The system had a lot of interesting features:

  • unprecedented for those times, the speed of serial photo shooting is 60 fps
  • super slow-motion movie mode
  • really compact sizes
  • interesting lenses for example Nikon 32 / 1.2 or Nikon 10-100 / 4.5-5.6 PD-ZOOM with electronic zoom
  • super fast autofocus
  • there was a protected camera for shooting under water and at low temperatures

A number of factors are the cause of death of the system, the main ones being the poor image quality and peculiar positioning of the system by Nikon.

Samsung NX System (APS-C, Kf = 1.5x)

The system was introduced on January 4, 2010, the last camera was introduced on February 6, 2015. Thus, the system lasted 5 years. Now Samsung NX is not developing and is considered dead.

A huge number of different cameras were released in several lines:

  1. NX5, NX10, NX11, NX20, NX30
  2. NX100, NX200, NX210, NX300, NX300M, NX500
  3. NX1000, NX1100, NX2000, NX3000, NX3300
  4. GalaxyNX
  5. NX1

And a large optics park:

  1. Samsung Lens 1: 3.5 10 mm Fisheye
  2. Samsung Lens 1: 2.4 16 mm i-Function
  3. Samsung Lens 1: 2.8 20 mm i-Function
  4. Samsung Lens 1: 2 30 mm
  5. Samsung Lens 1: 1.8 45 mm i-Function
  6. Samsung Lens 1: 1.8 45 mm 2D / 3D i-Function
  7. Samsung Lens 1: 2.8 60mm Macro ED OIS SSA i-Function
  8. Samsung Lens 1: 1.4 85 mm ED SSA i-Function
  9. Samsung Lens Premium 1: 2.8 S 300 mm ED SSA OIS i-Function
  10. Samsung Lens 1: 4-5.6 12-24 mm ED i-Function
  11. Samsung Lens 1: 3.5-5.6 EZ 16-50 mm ED OIS i-Function
  12. Samsung Lens 1: 2-2.8 S 16-50mm ED OIS i-Function
  13. Samsung Lens 1: 3.5-5.6 18-55 mm OIS i-Function
  14. Samsung Lens 1: 3.5-5.6 18-55 mm II OIS i-Function
  15. Samsung Lens 1: 3.5-5.6 18-55 mm III OIS i-Function
  16. Samsung Lens 1: 3.5-6.3 18-200 mm ED OIS i-Function
  17. Samsung Lens 1: 3.5-5.6 20-50 mm ED i-Function
  18. Samsung Lens 1: 3.5-5.6 20-50 mm II ED i-Function
  19. Samsung Lens 1: 2.8 S 50-150 mm ED OIS i-Function
  20. Samsung Lens 1: 4-5.6 50-200 mm ED OIS i-Function
  21. maybe some missed?

The system had great potential and a number of interesting features:

The reason for the cessation of the development of the line is considered to be Samsung's departure to the camera industry for smartphones.

Samsung NX-M System (Kf = 2.7x)

The system consists of only one representative: Samsung NX Mini with the Samsung NX-M mount introduced on March 19, 2014. For the camera, only three lenses were produced:

  1. Samsung 9 1: 3.5 ED NX-M Mount
  2. Samsung 17 1: 1.8 ED OIS NX-M Mount
  3. Samsung 9 – 27 1: 3.5-5.6 ED OIS NX-M Mount

There were rumors that the Samsung NX Mini 2 will appear in 2016, but the production was closed. The Samsung NX-M is an offshoot of the Samsung NX and is also dead.

Leica T system (APS-C, Kf = 1.5x)

There is only one camera Leica T (Type 701)introduced April 24, 2014 with the Leica T mount and for Leica T lenses.

Leica T lenses for cameras with APS-C sensor, Leica T mount:

  1. Leica SUMMICRON-T 1: 2 / 23 ASPH.
  2. Leica SUPER-VARIO-ELMAR-T 1:3.5-4.5/11-23 ASPH.
  3. Leica VARIO-ELMAR-T 1:3.5-5.6/18-56 ASPH.
  4. Leica APO-VARIO-ELMAR-T 1:3.5-4.5/55-135 ASPH.

On October 20, 2015 with the release of Leica SL (Type 601) mount T has been renamed mount L.

The Leica T crop camera system has been replaced / renamed to Leica TL system (camera Leica tl) from Leica TL lenses for cameras with APS-C sensor and bayonet Leica L (TL for crop and SL for full frame). The Leica T lenses from the list above were converted to Leica TL lenses. Later supplemented by system Leica TL2 и Leica CL.

The T mount was unified. It is very easy for an inexperienced user to get confused in this entire T, TL, SL, L, TL2 hash. Technically, Leica T was written off.

Pentax Q (Kf = 5.53x)

The system was introduced on June 23, 2011, in September 2012 the last camera was released Pentax Q10.

  1. Pentax Q
  2. Pentax Q10

The cameras were positioned as the lightest and most compact mirrorless cameras.

Pentax Q (Kf = 4.65x)

The system was introduced in June 2013, and the last camera was released on August 4, 2014 Pentax Q-s1.

  1. Pentax Q7
  2. Pentax Q-s1

There are 8 lenses for Pentax Q family cameras:

  1. SMC Pentax 1: 1.9 8.5 mm AL [IF] [LENS 01]
  2. SMC Pentax 1: 2.8-4.5 5-15 mm ED AL [IF] [LENS 02]
  3. SMC Pentax 1: 5.6 3.2mm FISH-EYE [lens 03]
  4. Pentax TOY LENS WIDE 1: 7.1 6.3 mm [lens 04]
  5. Pentax TOY LENS TELEPHOTO 1: 8 18 mm [lens 05]
  6. SMC Pentax 1: 2.8 15-45 mm ED [IF] [LENS 06]
  7. Pentax MOUNT SHIELD LENS 1: 9 11.5 mm [lens 07]
  8. SMC Pentax 1: 3.7-4 3.8-5.9 mm ED AL [IF] [LENS 08]

These lenses are suitable for both Pentax Q, Pentax Q10 cameras with Kf = 5.53X and Pentax Q7, Pentax Q-s1 cameras with Kf = 4.65X. In the names of the lenses, the aperture values ​​are confused with the values ​​of the focal length, apparently this is the main reason for stopping this system.

Pentax K-01 (APS-C, Kf = 1.5x)

February 2, 2012 an interesting camera was announced Pentax K-01, which was mirrorless, but with a long working length, which allowed her to use conventional SLR lenses with a Pentax K mount.

The camera was the first of its kind, providing an interesting concept. But already in February 2013 Pentax K-01 was officially discontinued and has sunk into oblivion.

Sigma sd Quattro (APS-C, Kf = 1.5x)

Consists of just one camera Sigma sd quattro, which was announced on February 23, 2016. Uses a special FOVEON sensor. The Sigma SA mount can use a huge variety of original Sigma SLR lenses. Most likely, it will not receive further development and will be replaced by a full-frame camera based on FOVEON.

Sigma sd Quattro H (APS-H, Kf = 1.3x)

Consists of just one camera Sigma sd quattro h, which was announced on February 23, 2016. Uses a special FOVEON sensor. The Sigma SA mount can use a huge variety of original Sigma SLR lenses. Most likely, it will not receive further development and will be replaced by a full-frame camera based on FOVEON.

Xiaomi / YI (Micro 4/3, Kf = 2x)

September 19, 2016 Xiaomi released its first mirrorless camera with M4 / 3 mount - Xiaoyi M1.

The camera could be seen with two lenses:

  1. Xiaoyi ZOOM LENS 12-40 mm 1: 3.5-5.6 (black / silver)
  2. Xiaoyi LENS 42.5 mm 1: 1.8 (black / silver)

Firstly Xiaoyi M1 was interesting the ability to record 4K video. If Samsung can make cameras, then why Xiaomi can not? But the thing is further Xiaoyi M1 did not go.

Kodak (Micro 4/3, Kf = 2x)

On January 7, 2014, the only Kodak mirrorless camera was announced - Kodak Pixpro S-1 with lenses:

  1. Kodak PIXPRO Aspherical ED Lens 12-45mm / 1: 3.5-6.3
  2. Kodak PIXPRO ED 42.5-160mm / 1: 3.9-5.9
  3. Fieldscope 400mm f / 6.7

Within 5 years, no further development was followed. Most likely, fierce competition with similar cameras from Olympus and Panasonic made themselves felt.

Ricoh GXR (GXR MOUNT A12, APS-C, Kf = 1.5x)

It is a modular system that includes a chassis (camera) onto which removable modules are attached. The modules consist either of a sensor with a fixed lens and a processor, or a separate module with a sensor and a bayonet mount. The only known module with a sensor and a bayonet is the GXR MOUNT A12 CMOS with a Leica M mount and an APS-C sensor.

The system was introduced on November 10, 2009, but has not received wide distribution and consists of only a few modules. Looks like this... Of course, this is not a classic mirrorless camera, but rather a rangefinder digital camera / system, as the GXR MOUNT A12 does not support auto focus.

Epson R (APS-C, Kf = 1.5x)

It is also worth remembering the first digital rangefinders (mirrorless cameras without autofocus and Live View). The first of them was the Epson R-D1 ('R' - 'Rangefinder' - Rangefinder), introduced in March 2004. Several modifications of this camera were released, based on the same sensor:

  1. Epson R-D1
  2. Epson R-d1s
  3. Epson R-D1x
  4. Epson R-D1xG

These cameras used a Leica M mount. Officially, this system was closed on March 17, 2014.

Hasselblad

September 18, 2012 was released the only cropped mirrorless camera Hasselblad lunar with Sony E-mount, camera-based Sony NEX-7. Three lenses were released for this camera:

  1. Hasselblad E 3.5-5.6 / 18-55 OSS LF Lunar (black / silver, copy Sony 18-55 / 3.5-5.6 OSS)
  2. Hasselblad E 3.5-6.3 / 18-200 OSS LF Lunar (copy Sony 18-200 / 3.5-6.3 OSS)
  3. Hasselblad E 2.8 / 16 LF Lunar (copy Sony 16 / 2.8)

Later Hasselblad lunar never received the receiver.

Results

You won't get very far on one mirrorless. Despite the fact that mirrorless systems have been predicted and are predicting a wonderful future, in real market conditions, entire mirrorless systems simply died out or completely ceased to develop. One of the main reasons for the decline of cropped mirrorless cameras is the improved capabilities of mobile phone cameras and the departure of many photographers and hobbyists to full frame or more advanced DSLR and mirrorless systems.

Materials on the topic

  1. Full frame mirrorless systems... Discussion, choice, recommendations.
  2. Cropped mirrorless systems... Discussion, choice, recommendations.
  3. Cropped mirrorless systems that have stopped or are no longer developing
  4. Digital SLR systems that have stopped or are no longer developing
  5. JVI or EVI (an important article that answers the question 'DSLR or mirrorless')
  6. About mirrorless batteries
  7. Simple and clear medium format
  8. High-speed solutions from Chinese brands
  9. All fastest autofocus zoom lenses
  10. All fastest AF prime lenses
  11. Mirrored full frame on mirrorless medium format
  12. Autofocus Speed ​​Boosters
  13. One lens to rule the world
  14. The impact of smartphones on the photography market
  15. What's next (smartphone supremacy)?
  16. All announcements and novelties of lenses and cameras

Comments on this post do not require registration. Anyone can leave a comment. A wide variety of photographic equipment can be found on AliExpress, The Amazon и B&H Photo.

Material prepared Arkady Shapoval... Look for me on Youtube | Facebook | Instagram | Twitter | Telegram.

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Comments: 205, on the topic: Mirrorless crop, sunk into the abyss

  • NEO

    Mirrorless Canon 1.6 is also in question, as soon as they release the crop on eos r, so eos m will immediately forget everything.

    • Arkady Shapoval

      Given that Canon itself does not develop the line, then it will be so. The lens kit for the Canon EOS M (EF-M) is very small.

  • Ivmulder

    Does Fujifilm still have a lenok of DSLRs or is now all the lines mirrorless? Then this is the opposite, successful example.

    • Arkady Shapoval

      Fujifilm has had no digital SLRs since 2007.

  • anonym

    pentax k-01 was.

    • Arkady Shapoval

      Exactly how I could miss this yummy

  • Lynx

    pff .. and how many DSLRs are gone, or have firms not yet begun to close?
    let's count. Pentax is still a half-dead system.
    Kodak
    fuji
    samsung
    dormouse ...
    "Thousands of them!"
    oh, bl, yes it’s similar to what the article is sucked from the finger, and we have a typical evolutionary selection, because well and not through the ass made systems (mikra, fuji, nikon. watering can) quite live and thrive.
    Wow what a surprise

    • Arkady Shapoval

      The fact is that we are talking about mirrorless mirrors that predicted a wonderful future, and they did not justify this future.

      • Lynx

        to whom ??
        who predicted a beautiful future?
        What specific mirrorless?
        pissed up samsung with its missing developers?
        Nikon, who himself scored immediately as soon as announced?
        a canon whom no one took seriously in the mirrorless market?

        Those who properly invested in the system were predicted. Fuji - took off robustly, at the beginning of the start of mirrorless cameras it was with them that most of the hype about mirrorless cameras was connected, Nikon Z6 and Z7 - people are in a fever in general. Sonya - no comment, any fucking hipster with an iPhone pokes at Aunt Sonya continuously.
        Moreover, the micra, which everyone hates for a small sensor, has devoured a large part of the videographers market and a part of the art photographers market.
        So where did the bezelkalki merge? dragging it only those who initially all were fucked.

        • Arkady Shapoval

          For example, the same Samsung NX was well spent on the system. For example, the same Canon M also initially received user support. Z6 / Z7 is generally out of place to mention here, since this is a note specifically about mirrorless crop. Mirrorless full frame just goes by leaps and bounds, which is discussed here.
          About mikra and "art" photographers you can argue well.

          • anonym

            Yes, Lynx is an oppressor; he, as a maximalist schoolboy, sees everything in black and white, and speaks the same language of youngsters and Internet gopnik trolls. He used to take him seriously, but he is far from both modern art and modern technology.

          • Lynx

            oh well, the very first reviews of M-ki were quite disappointing. Even taking into account the fact that Martynov with giblets is all fuji, it is difficult for him to refuse certain impartiality.
            “Spent” and “made good” are two different things. The current "lion-king-like-living" is an excellent confirmation of this.
            Proofs that "good from Samsung" is comparable to the costs of Panas or Fuji?
            .......
            I know several very good art photographers who have gone “from all over” to Olympus F. Yes, this is not “massively”, but a phenomenon no less rare than fans of Samsung. ))

            • Arkady Shapoval

              You can start with the fact that Samsung BSI put cameras in 2014, and only reached 2017 in Fuji. + The same lenses, as I noted, the same 16-50 / 2-2.8 has analogues? Etc. etc. But, of course, I understand what you mean.

            • anonym

              M system from Kenon dead end.
              Most likely they will cover her.
              - system development requires a capital investment in a collapsing market (-27% this year)
              - a sharp decline in prices for ff bz
              - cannibalism
              There is no sense in it now, absolutely.

              • Arkady Shapoval

                I guess so too. Most likely, the EOS R and EOS M crop will or will not come out. Although the M5 is already interesting.

          • Lynx

            And here we run into click-byte name.
            Instead of “mirrorless crop, which was stillborn” we get hype, uniting all mirrorless cameras in bulk and incorrect conclusions.

            • Arkady Shapoval

              Come on, only I pointed out in the article specifically about “Here we will talk about a mirrorless crop, ie about mirrorless cameras with a sensor smaller than 36 * 24mm. " and the conclusions also concern the crop. But as someone answered, it's really hard for you to please

              • Lynx

                Here I am such a capricious bitch. )))

              • Arkady Shapoval

                Everything is ok, I changed the title to “Crop mirrorless cameras that have sunk into the abyss”, otherwise it’s really, as if we are talking about everything at once.

              • Lynx

                well .. they took away the topic shit .. well, what kind of people. ((

          • Alexander

            I think that there is no system in the production of mirrorless cameras ... Each company sculpts what the invention was enough for ... They blinded some kind of "system", they mowed a little money, the demand fell - they closed, they came up with another - they mowed it - they abandoned it ... This is the principle of capitalism ... there has never been consistency in capitalist technical progress, because they (the capitalists) have always been, are and will be driven by only one thing - the thirst for profit ... And they will come up with one after the other that will bring them temporary profit and no system in this will not be all ... Mirrors have one fat minus - high power consumption and nothing can be done about it ... Mirrors also eat a lot, but still less ... All this eternal attachment to energy sources is the worst thing that now exists not only in cameras , in all other respects too ... Previously, the cameras were non-volatile, and even if in the same Zenit the battery of the exposure meter sat down, it was still possible to take off by setting the exposure coupler on the eye ... and numerous focusing points and multi-zone exposure systems are nothing more than marketing to increase value and they do not carry any other purpose, since the average exposure can be set using one photodiode and it will not differ from the multi-zone system in almost anything, and focusing can be done using one point and nothing will change in the quality of the photo ... Now the marketolochotron both in the camera industry and in sound equipment, and in other industries, has reached such an unprecedented scale that it is not even possible to evaluate it ... It would seem that now the camera industry has developed so much that cameras are already should cost a penny, even full-frame ones ... But the same Nikon Z costs so much that I don't even understand why they are needed at all ... Maybe in Japan or the USA someone buys them, but in Russia with such poverty, they will buy or bought them a couple of pros and that's it ...? Back in 2014, it was easy to buy a DSLR, such as the Nikon D7000, and the price was excellent, the carcass cost around 16 thousand, but now such cameras, I'm not talking about mirrorless cameras, the price of which is screwed up for no reason at all, have long been luxury item ...

            • Maksim

              The damned capitalists made the photo massive and high quality. And the damned bourgeois programmers made it possible to exchange pictures between users. And this is good. People need to talk to each other. Everyone has their own language of perception of the world. And the fact that a person sitting on one end of the earth can show another person on the other end of the earth what he sees is worth a lot. If it were not for the capitalists, you would be sitting in your bathtubs with a red lamp and your favorite helios or industrial. They would print their muddy photos and sculpt them into their little album with triangles.

              • Novel

                Would lie rather. At a depth of two meters. And they wouldn't even sprinkle it.

              • Alexander

                Nobody would be sitting anywhere, sooner or later, all this crap would have penetrated everywhere ... This is not about this, but about something completely different ... Do not confuse God's gift with scrambled eggs ... As for smartphones, this is still a scam ... Production costs a penny, and sell at what price ...? They drive young people into loans, and then these young people with these poking tools become morons ... They don't need anything, they don't think about anything, just poke them and watch idiotic cartoons and films ... So the capitalists plan to make obedient morons out of people, everyone in loans and people sitting in stupid social networks almost succeeded ... And as for “sitting on one end of the earth can show another person”, it's generally a madhouse, click whatever and send it to the same other and sit gee-gag ...! Beauty ... You can't imagine a better perspective ...

              • Alexander

                The novel is probably already in this matrix ... It can no longer formulate a thought ... Some set of words is not clear about what ...

              • Vitaly N

                Yes, everything is clear - hatred and death wish for those who are not in his matrix.

            • anonym

              I wanted to add. Viliya-Auto didn’t have a power source for the built-in exposure meter that worked on the photocell.

              • Fyodor

                The photocell ages over time, it seems, and its accuracy is considered less. Therefore, battery-powered exposure meters were considered cooler;)

          • zengarden

            Samsung NX had a great system, with great lenses. Why it was ruined is not clear.

            • Arkady Shapoval

              So the other day Samsung has released a 108 MP sensor for phones

              • zengarden

                What's the use of such a matrix, if the optics in smartphones are flawed, and the picture is good only due to post-processing by the processor ... but it is convenient and affordable, every smartphone owner can feel like a “photographer” 🙂 and this almost completely killed the “digital cameras” market ... myself I could not get used to these newfangled things, and my phone is a push-button Nokia; so you have to carry a normal camera in your backpack.

              • Dim

                It seems to me that this is Samsung’s revenge for being pushed out of the market. How will the pros offer customers pictures from some 30-50 megapixel shoes when anyone has a smart with a 108 megapixel sensor? If Sams drowns Nikon and Canon in one, then you can try again on a clean field. Business, it happened. ;)

              • Vitaly N

                Samsung pushed itself out, dropping camera lines and the lack of at least normal software support. Have you tried looking for drivers for Samsung devices? This is another quest. What place they are to users, so are users to them. Gnusmas are gnusmas. Elementary - their cameras support control from a smartphone on paper. And in fact, I was never able to run both of their programs, which were no longer updated. FIG knows how much. Their manager for distributing media content to the home network is simply unrealistic to find on their website, only on third-party resources.

            • Vitaly N

              EX was also good, only a direct competitor to smartphones. Samsung has a habitual business - to give up even good and successful ones, and software support is also tight.

          • Vladimir

            Samsung themselves scored on their system, simply turned off at the beginning of their life paths (maybe they decided that the return is not fast enough, maybe something else, but not the essence. Although the cameras were normal, and the glass and in general.
            Nikon originally created the system as an amateur, so as not to compete with DSLRs, while it seemed like there were even cameras with distinctive characteristics, but no one needs them. For the same Sony rx 100 with the same sensor size, at least the lens costs 1.8-2.8, but for Nikon a dull 3,5-5,6 and normal zoom cannot be obtained for any money.
            Canon went the same way as Nikon, only they decided not to do normal lenses.
            As a result, those who produce cameras and optics and have a living developing system (Fuji, Sony, Micra).

    • NEO

      Lynx, it's time to ban you! From you only carries some nonsense. Try to suck out such an article from your finger, or maybe you already knew about Lake and Xiaomi? We know your medium-sized masterpieces, sit and shut up

      • Lynx

        Azaz ... and here came the clown with a butchert, secretly flipping at my videos. )))
        at the same time so limited that even knew nothing about the watering can.

      • Maksim

        The lynx is bright and beautiful! And his pictures sometimes turn out to be authentic and very catchy). Banning Lynx is bad manners.

      • Iskander

        The lynx is generally untouchable here, probably because (in its terminology) it faps itself and, at the same time, the site owner. At the same time, he knows everything and about all systems, one might think that he has experienced everything. Lynx, don’t slip up, but go do some work. And on the topic of the article - Canon is not on the list! Canon takes a long time to harness, but goes fast. Are you jealous, nikonodrochers? (again, in the Lynx language)

        • Arkady Shapoval

          Not yet. Before the first APS-C EOS R

          • Iskander

            Canon's new mirrorless cameras will be RF mount? If so, then the fate of the EOS M series is sad. And perhaps they will remain in the “relatively compact” niche for amateurs and girls. Compatibility with a bunch of lenses is expensive. But EOS M lenses will die out for sure.

  • Dmitriy

    Thanks for the interesting information)

  • anonym

    Samsung is really a pity, nx were much more interesting than crafts from Olik and Panas. And 16-50 has no analogues at all (sigma 18-35 and kenon 28-70 / 2 is not considered). Now you can still buy a good nx for a penny

    • Michael

      I agree, it was he who attracted my attention at the time

  • anonym

    Only Mikra (because of the alliance) and Fuji (because they made it in time) remained afloat. Sony Crop is the bottom for the photo, they went full frame. Kenon crop - bottom. Samsung danced, danced and suddenly died. In reality, if you need a bzk crop for a photo, then only Fuj remains. Or someone might disagree with me?

    • Lynx

      Fuj is sad about the matrix.
      by its so-advertised “non-Bayer” matrix
      and also - the fragility of the system, which is completely unrepairable.

      • anonym

        For once, I agree with the trot.
        Wait a moment, the famous fujah fujah jumps in which is the letter P and will choke on everyone to prove that fuj rulez is forever and all who disagree are just radishes.

        • Lynx

          It cannot be denied that fuji is truly a breakthrough in the bzk class, and a host of decisions have pushed the industry into motion. Their technique is really very pleasant to take off and wear, and the lenses are very useful and pleasant.
          But the results are often of little interest (if this is not a "postcard photography"), and the weak technical base of production led to problems with quality and reliability, alas.

          • anonym

            Something strange, again forced to agree with a trot.

          • anonym

            X trans color filters can be safely attributed to marketing bubbles and an epic failure in terms of technology.
            The idea in a non-standard cell arrangement was to eliminate moire in the absence of an aa filter.
            In reality, it turned out that x trans is just as susceptible to moire as a buyer without an aa filter, i.e. There are no pluses, but the disadvantages of x trance remained: lower resolution, the complexity of the demosaic (it took years to finish the demosaic to the level of a buyer), the complexity and high cost of production.
            It's like putting a fifth wheel in the middle of the passenger compartment in a sedan, and then modifying the car for years so that the wheel does not interfere.
            Since x-trance turned out to be useless and problematic, Fuji came up with her own ISOs, and was a pioneer in using non-turn-off noise while recording rav.
            Well, the price, whoever had to pay for all this)

            • Arkady Shapoval

              In addition to sensors, Fuji has other things that people love about. In addition, this system of mirrorless APS-C has the widest fleet of optics, including professional focus.

            • Lynx

              I have not seen the data on the moire of x-trance, but alas, all its other disadvantages ...
              On the other hand, Fuji clearly hoped for the continuation of the epicness with super-ssd, but it did not work out.
              Even endless ambassadors, including Medvedev and Pinkhasov, did not help.

              On the other hand - if you really want fuji, but you don't want to be soared with x-trance, there is an early x100 (for which they still want 15 thousand on the secondary), with replaceable glasses - late inexpensive A-series, and sf-rangefinders.

        • Pokemon

          Anonymous has no money and no brains. I already saw something similar after 2014, when due to the inability to upgrade to new equipment, people began to look for flaws in it to justify their weakness and worthlessness. This is psychology, sorry Anonymous.

          • Arkady Shapoval

            I also seek out flaws, but there is always context. Actually, this article was just intended to show that mirrorless mirrorless discord.

            • anonym

              Arkady, in this case, everything is simple.
              X trans is an engineering failure, or will someone clearly explain its advantages? )
              Iso at the fuja is 1.5 feet inflated, even here the owners were surprised at this.
              As the lynx said, the sensor there is dull from dormouse.
              The cameras had a lot of problems with af, they partially finished a year ago.
              The reliability of the system is controversial, at Fujiforum it was discussed including the failure of lenses and carcasses.
              The price is very high for crop.
              Simple question - is it worth buying such a system if you are not a fanboy?

              A long time ago, e2 and pro carcases were really a novelty. But in 2019?

              • Arkady Shapoval

                And the problem is that there is nothing else. From the mirrorless crop for work, only the micra remains, who does not want crop 2.0, he goes to fuji. I do not see direct horror in fuja. I can easily stigmatize any system, but why? You take apart the fuj and you are happy, other users are filming it and are also happy. If you have money, then Fuj is very pleasant, if there is no money, then Fuj, of course, is not a cake at all. The same goes for any system :)

            • anonym

              Well, a little bit wrong.
              Firstly, bz crop y.5, 1.6 is meaningless in price, dimensions and weight.
              Exactly the same thing you get on ff bz.
              Crop 2.0 is very different in weight and size from ff bz, so it has its own tasks.
              Because of these obvious facts, neither kenon nor sony nor nikon is in a hurry to develop their bz crop.
              Fuj could not get out in bz ff and therefore loses.
              Explain what is the point of buying a crop of bz at a comparable price, weight and dimensions with ff bz?
              Hence the desperate attempts to reduce the price and replace the unsuccessful x trans with a cheap buyer in series A, a medium-format type release.

              By the way, Arkady, when you and I discussed nikon 1 and you argued that people like it. As I said, the system was shut down - just logic)

            • anonym

              In conclusion, MBA has long been conducting a course on the development of markets and products.
              In our era, markets tend to squeeze around a single, leader, max couple.
              If the network is Facebook, if it is online then Amazon, etc. Of course there are regional variations.
              Exactly the same thing goes on the photo market.
              The leader today is a mono product ff bz.
              All kinds of crop in that segment will leave.
              Who needs - ff bz, the bulk is smartphones.

            • Pokemon

              Arkady, I respect you as a talented professional photographer and I have no complaints about you.
              I really hope that you go to the Fuji representative or hire and take x-t30 / x-t3 for the evening. And write an honest opinion about Fuji cameras on this matrix. I am sad to see that there is still no registration and all poor beggars without brains and experience of owning these cameras defecate unreasonably on Fuji here. I am accused of fanboyism, and I just appreciate the good color and good output. In addition to Fuji, I have other cameras. Arkady, I really don’t want Radozhiva to turn into a garbage pit through the efforts of anregs-haters.
              Protect your site from freaks.

              • Arkady Shapoval

                They came running to complain again. I am for freedom, they write the same thing on the forums with registration. Not in this case.

            • anonym

              Pokemon, you are strange, like your clone novel, now it’s probably your turn.
              You only in the next topic mocked those who complained to Arkady of the trolls and then they themselves ran to complain.
              Is everything exactly fine with you?
              Calm down, your fuji is a completely normal system, no better and no worse than competitors.
              Here are the facts you don’t like so much
              - x trance has no advantages
              - x trans reduces the resolution of the green channel
              - x trans is more expensive than buyer
              - matrixes are ordinary sony
              - iso overstated by 1.5 stops
              No objections?
              Yes, a lot of lenses that Fuji invokes goats. Yes, a lot of carcasses and the usual color from Sonya with sometimes strange colors.
              Everything would be fine, but over the years ff bz has developed sharply and there is simply no sense in an expensive, heavy and overall crop.
              History repeats itself.

            • Novel

              Anonymous, you can generally be fifty people under one nickname.

            • Michael

              Dimensions and weight are directly dependent on the frame size. It doesn’t matter. So everything is not as wonderful as you describe. For the price, minuses x trance, yes

          • anonym

            Pokemon foams and floods, pours insults, but can not refute any fact.
            In his idiocy, he first accused me of praising new technologies and his ff mirrorless, and now he fantasizes exactly the opposite. This behavior is typical of a brainwashed fanboy, this is psychology, forgive Pokemon.
            Pokemon, you made my day! :)

            • Novel

              What is the fact? While someone sits and pisses, recording tons of videos about bad Fuj, photographs are taken on the bad Fuj and no one cares. Apart from a small group of haters and technodrochers, the platform's “problems” are of little interest to anyone.

              Quite a decent Samsung, which was praised by many owners, took and ended. How Nikon 1 ended and completely indecent. Sometimes something technically imperfect takes off, sometimes something technically perfect does not take off, this is the market.

            • Novel

              So my wife’s channel hatit is one crazy. She writes parodies to her for her dozens of subscribers, tells what a bad channel his wife has, what is wrong there and how it should be right. Revises every new video, parses every second and tons, tons of hatred. And she could create something of her own.

            • Pokemon

              1) I did not hear and did not see any Facts.
              I see only the relay of other people's thoughts.
              2) I appreciate the experience and can not stand balabolstvo.
              3) Please remind me of that conversation, I forgot something, and again you misinterpret the words of others.
              4) I never saw the answer to my question - what is the hatred for Fuji?
              5) I am not a fanboy of anybody’s brand. This is not productive.
              Actually, it’s difficult, having d4, d750, sd-1 Merrill, X100T, S3Pro, S5Pro and soon there will be 1Ds_mk3, followed by D3x from Japan.
              6) I am not interested in communicating with trolls who come to defecate, and then observe the reaction of the venerable public.
              7) Communication with the creatures with Nick Anoni (s) m I end here on Radozhiva. For their behavior is not like men's, but the behavior of schoolchildren in the puberty period. Communicating with the middle floor is uninteresting. For all questions and complaints about the trolls with the nickname anonism, I have been seeing a copy-paste of the same nonsense about Fuji, about double-crop and so on for six months now.
              8) I am sorry that Radozhiva still has no registration and is filling up with biomass like anonism, which only craps the same way, with the aim of trolling Fuji owners, while purely for fun, maybe I didn’t own these cameras.

            • anonym

              Roman, to your optometrist, all the facts above.
              Oh, you’re trolling again, are you a Pokemon clone?
              Always as soon as the pokemon falls silent, he climbs out with a flood some sort of romance with fantasies which focuses not on the topic but condemns and trolls with his fantasies.

        • Lynx

          oh, another clown rode up.
          Pokemon Clown.
          incompetent. otherwise I would have seen on this site both my reviews on the fuji system and the videos shown, and even knew that the bjc from fuji has been my main system for more than 1,5 years. )))
          And about this system, I know more than yours exactly.

          • Iskander

            Lynx, is it you who fooled Arkady? Admit it, demagogue. You are like a woman - listen to you and do the opposite)

        • Maksim

          \ Whose fanboy are you?

      • zengarden

        Fujiks have an excellent matrix. Maybe you just need to properly configure the camera? I have the same X-T10 as you have (or had); Why doesn't anything break with me? and I don't see any problems with color. Yes, and I shoot mostly in JPEGs, RAWs and no longer pick. It's just that each plot has its own settings. There would have been a stub on the matrix ... I just take a great interest in manual optics, and on long-focus lenses sometimes the stirring gets in the way.

    • anonym

      Fuj crop has already begun to sink, sales have plummeted. Because they rushed into a quasi-medium format. Again, they’ll probably come up with cell-type crap across to ride around the ears and sell mediocrity as a premium product.

      • Novel

        Sales fell sharply throughout the market.

        • anonym

          No. Ff bz decrease or not or minimum. Profit even increased.
          Mirrors and lenses to them fell to 40%.
          Fell bz crop of all kinds.

          Everything is logical, the general market is compressed due to crop and DSLRs, who should prefer bz ff as the best option.

          I think bz crop sony, kenon, fuj will soon be transferred to residual sales having stopped all types of its development.

          • Arkady Shapoval

            There are rumors that Nikon will still produce mirrorless crop.

            • anonym

              Nikon is doing very poorly with marketing.
              They can and release.
              Did they release the epic file df, nikon 1 and did not release the replacement d700?
              Do whistle croppers crop DSLRs that have fallen by 40% in sales?

              • wj

                In which place did Df become an epic fail? This is a niche camera, deliberately created for a niche audience. She never claimed mass character.

                Nikon 1, by the way, is also a good system, just too expensive and with a limited set of lenses. Well, Nikon did not invest properly in its development. But she also had unique use cases, especially with telephoto lenses and the FT1 adapter.

                And why do you need some kind of conditional replacement for the D700 if the D850 can do the same and even better?

      • Lynx

        Fuji's “medium format” was announced and put on the market long before the recent market drawdown, as a “part of the Fuji system” - the same ideology and ergonomics, but for a larger wallet and matrix.
        At the same time, the system is equipped with a good af, and cheaper than offers from Hassel.
        A kind of “street-sf”.
        And the matrix there is the usual Bayer one, without showing off, no one will cut separately the nebier under them.
        Another thing is that under-sf it is "under".

    • cybernetics

      > Sony Crop is the bottom for the photo, they went full frame
      The owners of the 6x00 Sony line are looking at you in surprise.

    • Iskander

      Crop Canon under the RF mount will be normal!

  • Paul

    Samsung NX is a pity, there really was a new jet, and they swung widely. Nikon 1 it was clear that trash, too much PR and too little matrix

    • wj

      Nikon 1 had no more PR than other models from the manufacturer. And a small matrix is ​​not necessarily a bad thing, it's just that the manufacturer did not fully implement its advantages (compactness) in his system.

  • anonym

    Arkady, Nikon 1 gave out a very bad picture not because of the size, but because of the aptima production matrix itself. There are many sensors of this size and smaller but with better color.

    • Arkady Shapoval

      Fixed
      But the size there also played a trick

    • wj

      What other color problems did you find in Nikon 1? Seriously? Or do not you know how to adjust the white balance? :)
      I speak as a long-term user of V1.

    • varezhkin

      aptina.

  • anonym

    Great humor!
    "In the names of lenses, the aperture values ​​are confused with the focal length values, apparently this is the main reason for the stop of this system."

  • Michael R

    Some tears for Samsung are not clear here. The color from the camera is a dull G!

    • Arkady Shapoval

      As trite as it may sound, color is not the whole system yet.

      • anonym

        On the example of Nikon 1, you can clearly see that the color for the photo system is very important)

        • Arkady Shapoval

          Only for certain tasks and for specific users. Nikon 1 had not only color problems.

          • wj

            Arkady, please tell us about Nikon 1's “color problems”. Other commentators are modestly silent on my inquiries on this topic.
            I just used Nikon V1 for several years and didn’t see any real problems, except perhaps consider the features of the JPG interpretation as an in-camera developer, but this is pure taste, and not a lack of cameras.

            • Arkady Shapoval

              As such, no cameras have problems with color. Here we are talking about the fact that color, in comparison with others, is none. And to summarize, then the color as such is not at all. This does not interfere with shooting and enjoying the picture and the color that is on it, but in comparison with something else, everything immediately falls into place.
              By the way, you wrote that bb solves the problem with color, but this is not so or not quite so. BB is only part of the story of color.

              • wj

                I mentioned the BB, because I have already come across on photographic forums with elementary illiteracy criticizing the color of a particular camera. If you finally ask them for examples of problematic shots, it turns out that either the BB is not in order on them (and therefore the conditional red is not entirely red), or the conditional “green” on the faces of the models is actually caused by light reflections from the green wall :) either some jambs with camera settings. This is already painful for me.

                And what do you specifically mean by “no color in comparison with others”? Subjective assessment of nra / not nra or something specific?

              • Vitaly N

                It is especially interesting to compare “correct” shots with a real subject. Sometimes you may not even recognize :)))

              • Michael

                Rather, it is more subjectivism, and by g ... color they mean color errors. Color in highlights-medium-shadows can walk well from the reference. And then it can be difficult to remove these "liberties", you have to deal with serious color correction to get a good result

              • wj

                (answer to Michael)

                I have no idea what they mean when they talk about g .... color. Nobody usually specifies :) color critics usually lack analytical thinking at all.

              • Michael

                WJ, things are not good with color analytics, experience is more important here. You also ask to tell about the lens drawing - there will be holivaar))) In general, the color is not an easy thing, you cannot describe it in a nutshell, there are many nuances.

        • varezhkin

          +1 such a # $ florist as the ones still look for. Nikon's greed = spoons of honey in a tar barrel, stupid marketing in the form of riveting new models (now not so) and dumb, dull color profiles destroyed the system.

          • wj

            Do you have examples of this same # $ florist that you could share? And then here in the comments from half a dozen people swear at him, but no one can explain what exactly the problems are there :)

            • Arkady Shapoval

              Do you have an example of good color?

              • wj

                I don't have an example of a good color and no one can have one. Because “good color” is like “delicious sandwich” - everyone has their own.

                And so, I had no complaints about color to any system camera that I used to use (mostly different nikon and a few canons).

    • R'RёS,R ° F "RёR№

      From the camera he is not G ... but just a little colored and was painted as you like. And what's the point that I put neutral in Fuji ... let's paint and the picture pours. I'm about JPG. With RAW, except for a large file in the Samsung, everything was not bad.

    • wj

      Again these clowns with their whining about the color at Canon / Nikon / Samsung / etc ... You do not know how to adjust the white balance? Or don't you shoot in RAW? A long time ago, you can wind yourself up with such a color in the editor you like. Damn amateurs ...

      • Novel

        Do not encroach on sacred things. Two themes are eternal and divinely unattainable - COLOR and SOVIET lenses.

      • Novel

        There is also the St. Binding Sect, but everything is especially complicated and tasteless there.

  • R'RёS,R ° F "RёR№

    Samsung NX is very sorry, the 30mm 2.0 pancake was wonderful.
    Why couldn’t we go further ???
    Okay, Nikon 1 was doomed. Although the case of the V series was cool, at least the crop matrix.
    Having taken off all this and switched to Fujifilm, I was disappointed that besides color and design, there is nothing good in it.

  • Alexey

    Crop is losing ground, and not only mirrorless, and that's fine. A DSLR f.ph. mirrorless, and this is also normal.

  • Arkady Shapoval

    I added here the lone Sigma SD Quattro and Sigma SD Quattro H, since for 3 years they also did not receive updates and are in the mirrorless reserve on the verge of extinction.

  • Michael

    And for whom was this expensive mischief intended? For amateurs?

  • Paul

    If Canon releases a crop to the EOS R system, then this may be considered the end of the EOS M.
    The reasons for this are as follows:
    1. EOS M and EOS R systems are absolutely incompatible in optics, i.e. it is physically impossible to put the lens R on the carcass M.
    2. The EOS R system is technically more advanced than the EOS M system, which was originally positioned as purely amateur.
    3. The cameras of the M system are the most compact of mirrorless crop, but here they compete with the new Sigma fp camera, which at absolutely the same size as the Canon EOS M6 is a) full-frame and b) technically much more advanced.

    True, there are rumors that Canon will introduce the updated M5 and M6 carcasses under the nickname Mark II at the end of August this year, but the improvements will only concern the increase in matrix megapixels from 24 to 30, a slightly more overclocked Digic 8+ processor and an improved video signal processing algorithm. There will be no cardinal improvements like the matrix stub or the new Digic 9 processor in the new Emki.
    R-crop, I think, will come out immediately with a new processor, and with a matrix stub.

    • Novel

      It is physically possible to put the lens R on the carcass M, two millimeters of difference in the working distance allow. But Canon said in an interview that tolerances are needed so that no one will do it. Not worth the candle game.

  • Alexey Akhtyamov

    It would be cool if manufacturers continued to produce cameras with ccd.

    • Michael

      They, like, are still being released, only in a different league

    • Vitaly N

      What's good? Adding colors, low DD, noise and low read speed? Now, if we made a modern 6-10 megapixel crop matrix with backlighting ... Not everyone needs FF, but such a matrix could compete for high ISO

      • Michael

        At low isos, noise in ssd is lower than smos. A high iso worse

        • Vitaly N

          Due to the low DD and less noise.

          • Michael

            Quite possibly

          • Fyodor

            No need for DD, open Wikipedia and read about CMOS CCD (CMOS CCD). Another thing is that manufacturers have abandoned them and do not develop them.
            And they don’t develop it because CMOS is much cheaper, and the circuitry as a whole turns out to be cheaper - half of the camera’s electronics can be immediately placed on one CMOS chip. Well, there are also advantages, of course, in fact, everything, except, perhaps, the quality of the photos (just because of the higher DD and color rendering).

        • anonym

          No. Is there any proof at all?
          Comparison of modern kmos and ssd?

          • Arkady Shapoval

            Well, is there a modern CCD in the user segment?

            • anonym

              Ccd until recently used teledyne dalsa.
              Prom about the same ssd everywhere stopped, Sonya closed her 200mm line in Kagoshima, like in 2015 or 2016, recently.
              Truesense, which has now changed its name, still offers ff ssd.
              The reasons for refusing loans are very simple, here is the opinion not of the “tough pro” Michael, but of the manufacturer
              CMOS has traditionally had a reputation for lower image quality, however recent sensors have surpassed the image quality of Sony CCDs in terms of noise and dynamic range. This, coupled with the numerous advantages of CMOS sensors such as speed, lower power consumption, less support electronics and the elimination of tap balancing is the natural evolution of technology.
              Let me remind you that ssd from sony were the best in color, noise and dd and today kmos is completely and in particular better than ssd.

              • Michael

                So, of course, compare the latest smos with 10 year old ssd. Who doubts that smos will be better

              • Vitaly N

                Michael, even comparing kmos with ssd, when they coexisted together in soap dishes, ssd was losing a lot. Someone likes their color, but it's like an old car without a top, which can only be enjoyed in certain greenhouse conditions. And don’t improve it, but it will keep warming, slow and noisy.

              • Fyodor

                Yes, there was never such a thing. I read, probably, 3 comparison reviews of past years (and there weren’t more to be found), almost identical cameras with different matrix technologies (like Nikon D3000 vs D3100). And in each, the difference was either not felt at all, or the colors on the CCD were still better.

              • anonym

                Michael, carefully read the post above. Where did you get your 10 year old ssd from? Today, it seems like 2019, the last Sony ssd about va 2015 was compared with kmos of the same time. And this quote is from the Sony representative himself, when they decided to close them. Do you think Sony knows the subject better? )

              • Fyodor

                Yes, most likely the manufacturer put it on the CCD a long time ago, and a modern CCD is not much different from a 10-year-old one. We've heard a lot of CMOS marketing improvements: backlighting (finally figured out how to remove the wires back), vertical row or something like that .. And not a word about CCD.

              • Michael

                Vitaly, I don’t argue. Everything that you wrote above is true. SMOS is better. Just comparing the contemporaries of SMOS and SSD, it turned out that on the base ISO, the SSD makes less noise, possibly due to the low DD. Actually everything) It was Anonymous who spread everything here and about everything, and without everything

              • Michael

                Production 2015, and what year of development? SSD technology has died a long time ago. So it is correct to compare the SSD of which thread 2010 and the corresponding SMOS

              • Arkady Shapoval

                I wrote in the user segment, not in the corporate segment. What are the latest CZK or BZK for the photo. It’s after all about cameras, ordinary cameras for amateurs and pros, and you show up about teledyne and truesense

            • anonym

              What Michael writes is absurd.
              Firstly, the development of ssd did not stop, why did he invent it again?
              Secondly, according to his strange logic, to compare carts and cars, we must take a 1913 cart and a car of the same time and draw thoughtful conclusions that the trolley bus is the fastest car because it runs tied, but if untied!)
              SSD has reached a logical dead end in its development. The industry switched to kmos. Today kmos in all respects is better than SSD and there is simply no sacred meaning in SSD and old cameras on them.

          • Michael

            There will be no proofs. Personal observations. And not modern smos and ssd (of which there is no small format), but old ones. Apparently, all statements without YouTube and links to cool pros are not quoted by you.

            • anonym

              Michael, well, you certainly can and consider yourself a cool pro, this is your business.
              But so far, none of your statements is supported by any sources or photos.)
              Well, absolutely nothing but your statement is very cool prof.)

              • Michael

                I'm not cool and not a pro. I said that these are my personal observations. Your words are also not supported by any links and photos. Only quotes ripped from unknown articles.

              • anonym

                Why should I prove something to you? The entire industry has switched to KMOS. The best in color for imatest are kmos, the best for dd and noise - kmos. What else does? No, I understand, there are always those who think that earlier the grass was greener, the girls are more beautiful and in general,)
                It is useless for such people to prove anything; they are in the past, not of this world.

              • Michael

                Well, don’t get alarmed

    • wj

      What is the sacred meaning in the CCD matrix? Or are you from that old sect that prayed for the old 6-megapixel nikon? :)

      • Arkady Shapoval

        Pray only at 6MP Epson RD CCD

    • anonym

      There is simply not the slightest sense in SSD today. They have long been no longer the best in color, more expensive, more noisy, etc.

  • Michael

    Arkady, did the sigma sensor seem to be called Foveon or am I confusing something?

    • Arkady Shapoval

      Fixed

  • Aries

    to look and build on frosted glass, seeing natural color-small details is always more convenient than the electronic flickering or non-flickering viewfinder screen

  • Koba

    Thinking that this is not a problem with mirrorless cameras in general, but the fact that smartphones are developing very much, even zooms began to be installed there, and larger sensors, with powerful image processors, which covers the basic requirements of the overwhelming mass of users. Let's not forget that 99% of people in the world are not photographers, but just people who take photographs (not photographs, just photographs, in Russian there is not even such a difference between these terms as in English - snapshoot and photograph), yes , there are those who like to shoot with better quality than smartphones gave and it was them that the crop was focused on, there are millions of them, but gradually the prices for ff decreased, and all of them, one way or another, dreamed of filming with ff, therefore, the crop market gradually went down. After 10 years of production, the world also received a huge amount of buff equipment, and amateurs and not rich, as well as smart professionals very often use just the technique, so the companies began to more rigidly implement the so-called quality standards, which implies not improving the quality like this naive users can think, and that the product does not break during the warranty period, and then necessarily breaks down and is not repairable. Fuji is very advanced in this, his products break down precisely after the expiration of the warranty period, the lenses stop working on new cameras, etc. I am sure that in other companies technical managers are being given the whim to take the example of fuji. Do not forget that the production of products for companies under capitalism is not an end in itself, the main thing for companies is making a profit by selling a particular product. The fact that a particular company at different times manages to sell its products at very high prices is not his merit, but an indicator of the stupidity of customers who have always been proud of it and will always be proud of it. To maintain this very stupidity, marketing departments of companies are called upon to work ... The second reason for the death of mirrorless crop is the usual overproduction that takes place under capitalism, that is, it is also a systemic phenomenon, and not something exclusive from the photography industry. Ultimately, everything will return to what it was before the digital era - non-photographers will be content with smartphones, there will be a small part of amateur photographers who will use crop systems, and professionals or advanced amateurs, their number also increases, but not so dramatically, they will remain real photographers. 99% of the world's photographs are simple photographs, simple capturing of moments, and only 1% in one way or another can be attributed to photography that has some objective value. By the way, so far we do not see a particular enthusiasm for professionals to switch to mirrorless cameras, I mean those who use cameras like the Canon 1D and Nikon D5. Recently, I was in Beijing at a sporting event and specifically looked at a group of photographers, both Chinese and foreign, I can say that 90% of them were holding Canon 1Dx, the rest were Nikon D5 or even Nikon D4s. That's it. Companies needed mirrorless cameras to further reduce the cost of cameras and increase profits, this will continue, but there are areas where at least they have not yet got along ... Sales of the Sony A9 did not go in any way, none of the professionals actually switched to it, to which Sony's company hoped very much, they even set the price for the A9 at around $ 4000 in order to rip off the jackpot on their super-expensive lenses later, but no one took a bite, partly because the difference in weight in this segment simply cannot be obtained due to the huge weight of the lenses, partly because modern DSLRs are more than adequate for 99% of the requirements of the respective photographers. Personally, I predict that in this segment (and I personally can’t call the other segments really super professional, since medium-sized cameras like the Canon 5D and Nikon 850 are mostly professionally used by wedding planners and for studio and landscape photography), we will most likely see Canon 1Dx3, and Nikon D6 and so on for a long time. One of the marketing managers of some company even said in an interview that the mirrorless fashion will partly go away and it is possible that some people will return to the mirrors. I also went this way and now I have the Pentax K-01 working fine with a wonderful matrix and capabilities to re-read a large number of books, but after using the Sony A72 I very soon returned to the old Nikon D3s and will never look at the mirrorless again.

    • Paul

      👍👍👍 !!!

    • Arkady Shapoval

      About the transition to DSLRs and the end of the fashion on the BZK Pentax representative spoke, it is understandable for what reasons.

    • Arkady Shapoval

      Thanks for the expanded comment.

      • anonym

        Pretty obvious things.
        Recall why the crop appeared at all.
        There were two reasons - problems with those ff process and the price of the ff sensor.
        Today, the photo market is shrinking altogether.
        No problems with the process and matrix ff fell in price to its minimum.
        As a result, the new ff camera is already worth about $ 1000.
        Plus a huge market for bu ff cameras.
        Therefore, it is very difficult to find a clear reason for investing in the development of crop; this segment collapses very quickly and permanently.
        And that means there will be no new lenses, development, etc. Well, they’ll release a couple of three of the next castrated bells and whistles and that's all.
        From the point of view of the buyer, it makes no sense to invest in a dead format.
        Ff in every sense is more interesting. As Arkady said, ff after the crop is like a breath of fresh air.
        If you are a fan of the old Soviet optical trash, then again ff is better, on crope all the beauties are cut off.

        • Vitaly N

          The mirror crop won't die soon, at least the news stories. Due to the fact that no matter what they do, they will not be able to increase the focusing area on FF cameras. It will remain in the center the size of Micra's matrix. At the expense of the BZK - I agree, it will survive only as a separate system, and not as a crop from the existing one.

          • anonym

            The mirror crop for the photo of hunting and reporting will remain, perhaps it will begin to rise in price. There will be no new lenses for him or they will be very expensive. Bz crop is meaningless in principle, it is completely covered by ff bz segment and has no advantages.

            • Vitaly N

              Tell Mikra :)

              • anonym

                I'll clarify - I was talking about crop 1.5 and 1.6.
                Mikra in use is twice a crop. There their troubles and their market segment, with ff little overlap.

              • Vitaly N

                Well, I wrote about this.

    • Iskander

      Perhaps capitalists will someday understand that a mirrorless camera cannot cost more than a DSLR of the same class, if only because of the higher cost of DSLR mechanisms. I think that any consumer goods mirrorless shit will soon quickly depreciate on the secondary - and then it will be possible to take it. I will do so when my DSLR barks - I'm not particularly upset, I'll pick it up for parts and buy a five-year-old BZK - I will definitely not go wrong with the price.

      • Maksim

        Why can't it, comrade socialist? Read, at your leisure, how the camera works. It's not about the presence or absence of a mirror.

    • zengarden

      > Recently I was in Beijing for a sporting event and specifically looked at a group of photographers, both Chinese and foreign, I can say that 90% of them were holding Canon 1Dx, the rest Nikon D5 or even Nikon D4s.
      So this is a "sporting event", where appropriate, reportage cameras are needed; who will shoot there with mirrorless cameras? unless a video on Panasonic ... here everything is selected for specific tasks. Sports, portrait, landscape, subject - for every task you need your own tool, there are practically no universal ones.

    • Onotole

      Not 'snapshoot', but 'snapshot'.
      snapshoot is a process.

    • varezhkin

      Thoroughly as you described everything. Thanks.

  • Paul

    The main advantage of mirrorless cameras in comparison with DSLRs is the absence of the mirror itself and, as a result, the absence of front and back focus.
    The dimensions and weight of mirrorless mirrors, as our dear Olympus showed, do not play any role at all))
    It may be argued that the image seen in the viewfinder of a DSLR is more “natural” than that seen in EVF or on a mirrorless screen. I thought so myself when I was shooting at Zenith. 😂
    When, in the process of shooting, I adjust the color temperature or RGB for each specific frame, as a result of which I see on the screen of the camera and at home on the screen of the calibrated monitor ABSOLUTELY THE SAME PICTURE that my eye saw during shooting, when I have the opportunity to shoot at dusk, almost at night, and at the same time see a clear and bright picture taken - what kind of mirror can we talk about in the camera at all ?!

    Yes, FF-DSLRs will remain, and for quite a long time, but this will be a niche of purely professional and extremely reliable devices, which will be used to shoot sports, extreme sports, wars, nature and other “delights”.
    Crop, both mirrored and mirrorless, will die out as a class, and the former will die out much faster. The niche of the crop will be occupied by incredibly “wiser” smartphones.
    FF-mirrorless cameras will remain for those who will not be satisfied with “photos”, but will have a need for Photos.

    • Paul

      Let me express my personal opinion on the topic.
      1. Mirror fullframe is not for me, I spoke about this at the beginning of the previous post.
      2. At the moment I shoot with a mirrorless crop, specifically - with a Canon EOS M6, and I absolutely do not use my native EF-M optics. I believe that mirrorless crop has reached its technical limit and a further increase in picture quality can only be achieved with an increase in the physical dimensions of the matrix. Nevertheless, crop is acceptable for the vast majority of amateur tasks. In order not to be unfounded, I will give two examples of photos taken on my M6 with the help of: the first - a modern autofocus Tamron SP 90 / 2,8 Macro, the second - a manual MC Jupiter-9 85/2.
      https://psv4.userapi.com/c848224/u186682217/docs/d10/7ce1627ffa8a/IMG_8247.jpg?extra=9LmmZwQft5pH5l1Ay41s64ykO-pDhkFjruwy-If5JMBROz2b_LWXQHN-OEhrB8i3wieiKQ81WFyUeCGv43aWa-0rV99ObvS4CLAIJ1G7XpMgAA2Mg1X8EyoJQO35141ilnNtsb32wVMLgLEIjAs1I0gr
      https://psv4.userapi.com/c848424/u186682217/docs/d2/72f9707f6c32/IMG_8917.jpg?extra=x4yVYxPA2HW6EiO3MKwzw-Rx_V8o5RnwLRUJkyt_lsjza7C-HPuR5Vih__Uc-NKLs2IURhKm1jea9rA5DnxHHkbsniFMy8IONuREaBvA_CLJJ-JMyHq9YGs8t2x-dSzc5MJj6M1qM1-1Ao3O8UOpjZY8
      3. I personally really like the experience of Sigma, which will soon present the baby Sigma fp and is preparing to release a full-frame Foveon (God forbid that they succeed!)

    • Iskander

      When smartphones “become incredibly wiser”, they will turn into a crop with the ability to make calls. And they will have dimensions, for example, like the Canon G-series. What the hell?

      • Paul

        I have no idea buddy! Someone else's (yours in this case) head - darkness))

    • Vladimir

      The main plus of mirrorless cameras is that in the viewfinder the picture is the same as the camera sees it, after all the processing (well, almost). And this means that if something is dark, then we will see it dark, if overexposure, then there will be a white spot. And on the mirrors, the brightness distribution is not so obvious, plus the exposure metering works on average, that is, you always need to keep in mind the thought of how the metering works and there should be a darker or brighter picture, relative to how the camera sees it.

      • BB

        Working with (D) SLR teaches you to think. The DSLR has always been a tool for those who are at least a little versed in the technique of shooting (or want to learn). For the rest there were / are compacts (first film, then digital), telephones, mirrorless (choose any on your pocket and wallet).

        • Novel

          Working with a cart makes you think. Where to harness a horse, where to cling a bag for manure.
          Therefore, anyone who wants to learn how to drive a Skoda sedan on an automatic machine definitely needs to first learn how to drive Egyptian chariots, then carts, then carburetor cars without amplifiers, abs and on the manual.
          And in general, on a trip to Paris do not take a smartphone but take a compass and navigate the stars!

  • PetrCh.

    ... but cameras and lenses remain and work fine and will be relevant for another five years, and during this time smartphones will develop so much that they will dominate the non-professional segment of the market ..

  • Igor

    DO THESE XXX FOR THOSE WHO EVERY 200-500 grams SEVERITY + Serve Compact and easy NOT to surpass classical ZERKALKU.KOMU HARD shoot normal equipment REMOVE telefonchik NOW BENEFIT OF SUCH LOSHARIKOV not a little and wait SHEDEVRA.V STUDIO Masters say, I ask, THAT A LOT OF REPLICATIONS FOR PRINT OPERATORS, THAT THE BAD SOURCES ARE NOT EVEN DRAWING MUCH IN THE EDITOR, REMOVE A FINGER, AND WANT A HIGH QUALITY.

    • Michael

      In every perversion there is only a fraction of perversion. It would be nice if it were easier, only unrealistic due to the size of the matrix and, accordingly, the optics park. My cropping kit does not fit into my carry-on luggage, I will hang myself with ff - they will only be allowed to walk on foot)

      • Vitaly N

        This is how many lenses then? My backpack certainly pulls great, but the size passes with a margin.

        • Michael

          In terms of dimensions, it also passes, but in terms of weight - almost 5 kg + a tripod another 1-1.5 kg. And the girl politely slaps her eyes and says - check in your luggage. This is not always, of course, usually I cheat, but they wrapped it up a couple of times

          • Nvitaliy N

            Never weighed a backpack, you pretend that easy: 0

      • Novel

        I generally have enough photo bags for trips with an attached additional compartment. It goes like a photo bag always, along with a backpack.

      • Vladimir

        I wonder what kind of kit you have. If we take fixes, then the mirrorless crop + 3-4 fix takes up little space, and weighing two kilograms together. If you take zooms, then the set of the camera + three zooms will weigh within 3 kg and take up a bit more space.

        • Vitaly N

          It's about cropping.

          • Michael

            Yes, a mirrorless is minus 300, it doesn't make the weather)

        • Michael

          D300, 10.5 2.8, 11-20 2.8, 35 1.4, 70-300 plus filters and batteries. 3 kg in any way, it turns out 4 with a tail + the weight of the bag itself comes out about 5 kg + tripod.

  • Arkady Shapoval

    Also added the modular extinct Ricoh GXR to the list of deceased.

  • Eugene

    THERE ARE ALL AND THE ROAD.
    SOAP ... ARIES

    • anonym

      The man said, by some miracle, having accumulated 550 d (or an analog) on ​​his boot. No more than an attempt to protect his DSLR.

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